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Tesla could be using a “4416” battery cell in Model 3 and next-gen S, X fleet

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Just days before Tesla releases official details for Model 3, including battery pack sizes and their respective driving range, a new rumor has emerged pointing to a new “4416” lithium ion battery cell being produced by the Silicon Valley-based electric car maker.

The news comes to us from Ben Sullins at Teslanomics who received an insider tip that Tesla has produced a significantly larger cylindrical battery cell that’s roughly 44mm in diameter and 160mm in height, also known as a 44160 cell, and currently being used in the Model 3 battery pack. The new information goes against previous speculation that Tesla will be using it’s newest high energy density 2170 cell in the Model 3. Tesla’s Gigafactory is currently producing 2170 cells for use in its commercial Powerwall and Powerpack battery storage systems.

We had previously reported that Model 3 will be available in a 60 kWh and 75 kWh battery pack option. Unlike Tesla’s flagship Model S and X which currently utilizes its traditional 18650 battery cell, packaged within 16 individual battery modules, Model 3 will utilize only 4 modules containing the much larger and higher energy density 44160 cell.

Though the new insider tip is highly speculative, a new cell design with higher energy density would validate Musk’s previous reveal that Model 3’s shorter wheelbase can only support up to a 75 kWh pack if used with Tesla’s current cell type. Musk also recently confirmed that their are no plans to use the 2170 cells in Model S and Model X vehicles.

A larger and more energy dense 44160 lithium ion cell would allow Tesla to presumably use less cells, lower battery pack weight, while achieving the same energy output. This would also explain why recent spy shots showing the battery meter on the Model 3 center display revealed that it was capable of over 300 miles of range from a 75 kWh pack. A lighter vehicle with a more energy dense battery pack means greater range.

Model 3’s assumed 310 mile driving range represents nearly a 20% increase over a Model S 75 which achieves 259 miles of range with a 75 kWh battery. Incidentally, Tesla confirmed that Model S 75 in rear wheel drive will be discontinued, fueling even more speculation that Tesla could be bringing 44160 cells to future Model S and Model X vehicles that are due for a refresh.

What do you think? Leave us your thoughts in our forum.

Updated: Tesla has confirmed the use of 2170 form factor cells in the Model 3

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Check out today’s Monday Teslanomics Live News where Ben discusses his thoughts around the topic.

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Tesla analyst compares Robotaxi to Waymo: ‘The contrast was clear’

“In short, robotaxi felt like a more luxurious service for half the cost and the driving felt more human-like.”

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Credit: Tesla

Tesla analyst Jed Dorsheimer of Wall Street firm William Blair compared the company’s Robotaxi platform to Waymo’s driverless ride-sharing program, and had a clear-cut consensus over which option was better in terms of rider experience.

Dorsheimer visited Austin recently to ride in both Tesla’s Robotaxi ride-sharing program and Waymo, which has operated slightly longer than Tesla has in the city. Tesla started rides on June 22, while Waymo opened its vehicles to the public in March.

A Tesla Model Y L Robotaxi is a legitimate $47k Waymo killer

The analyst gave both platforms the opportunity to present themselves, and by the end of it, one was better than the other in terms of rider experience. However, he noted that both platforms gave safe and smooth rides.

Overall, there was a tremendous difference in the feel and environment of each option.

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Tesla Robotaxi vs. Waymo

Dorsheimer said that Tesla’s first big advantage was vehicle appearance. Robotaxi uses no external equipment or hardware to operate; just its exterior cameras. Meanwhile, Zoox and Waymo vehicles utilize LiDAR rigs on their vehicles, which made them “stick out like a sore thumb.”

“In contrast, the robotaxis blended in with other Teslas on the road; we felt inconspicuous flowing with the traffic,” he added.

The next big victory went in the way of Robotaxi once again, and it concerned perhaps the most important metric in the ridesharing experience: price.

He continued in the note:

“Confirming our thesis, robotaxi was half the price of Uber, showing its ability to win market share by weaponizing price.”

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In terms of overall performance, Dorsheimer noted that both platforms provided safe and “top-notch” experiences. However, there was one distinction between the two and it provided a clear consensus on which was better.

He said:

“In Austin, we took multiple robotaxi and Waymo rides; the contrast was clear. Aside from the visual difference between each pulling up to the curb, the robotaxi was comfortable and familiar, and it felt as though a friendly ghost chauffeur was driving our personal car. Driving was smooth and human-like, recognizing and patiently waiting for pedestrians, switching into less crowded lanes, patiently waiting to execute a safe unprotected turn, and yet, discerning and confident enough to drive through a light that just turned yellow, so as not to slam on the brakes.

Waymo also provided a top-notch service, and we did not encounter any safety concerns, but if we were to be overly critical, it felt more … robotic. In the cabin, you have to listen to an airline-esque preamble on Waymo and safety protocols, and during the ride, you can hear all the various spinning lidar sensors spooling up and down with electronic whizzing sounds.”

Tesla Robotaxi provides an experience that seems to be more catered toward a realistic ride experience. You can control the music, the cabin temperature, and transitioning your travel from one vehicle to the next during a trip will continue your entertainment experience.

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If your first trip ends in the middle of a song, your next trip will pick up the music where it left off.

Meanwhile, Waymo’s experience sounds as if it is more focused on rider expectations, and not necessarily providing a ride that felt catered to the occupants. Still, what’s important is that both platforms provided safe rides.

Dorsheimer ended the note with one last tidbit:

“In short, robotaxi felt like a more luxurious service for half the cost and the driving felt more human-like.”

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Tesla offers new deal on used inventory that you won’t want to pass up

Tesla opened up lease deals on used Model 3 and Model Y inventory in California and Texas on Tuesday, marking the first time it has launched the option on pre-owned cars.

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Credit: Tesla

Tesla is offering a new deal on its used vehicle inventory that consumers looking for a great deal won’t want to pass up.

Traditionally, Tesla has not allowed potential car buyers to lease its used inventory. The only two options were to buy with cash or finance it through Tesla or a bank.

However, with the elimination of the $7,500 new and $4,000 used EV tax credits, Tesla is breaking its own rules and is now offering lease deals on its used vehicle inventory, but only in a couple of states, as of right now.

Tesla is ready with a perfect counter to the end of US EV tax credits

Tesla opened up lease deals on used Model 3 and Model Y inventory in California and Texas on Tuesday, marking the first time it has launched the option on pre-owned cars.

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The deals are tremendous and can cost as little as $0 down and under $225 per month for some vehicles.

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Tesla also allows customers to buy the vehicle at the end of their lease deal, which enables some really great ways to end up an owner of the car you plan to drive for the next two or three years.

The lease deal also helps Tesla rid itself of older vehicles that might not be of future use to the company. It formerly planned to use leased vehicles in its eventual Robotaxi fleet, but many of the cars in its used inventory have Hardware 3, which is less capable than Hardware 4, which is installed in the new Model 3 and Model Y.

More importantly, Tesla is giving people yet another way to be in the market for a Tesla before the tax credit ends on September 30.

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Tesla Model Y L might not come to the U.S., and it’s a missed opportunity

The Model Y L has a variety of big changes that would be advantageous for the U.S. market, including a longer wheelbase, more comfortable seats, a third row that appears to be more spacious than Tesla’s six-seat Model Y that it previously offered, B-Pillar vents for rear passengers, and more.

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Credit: Tesla China

Tesla’s new Model Y L might not come to the U.S., CEO Elon Musk said this morning.

It’s a missed opportunity, and I’m not the only one who feels this way.

In the past, I have personally written a handful of articles about what Tesla owners have been wanting in the United States: a full-sized SUV, or at least a vehicle that is larger than the Model Y but less of a crossover than the Model X.

Tesla is missing one type of vehicle in its lineup and fans want it fast

The only thing that Tesla has announced that even slightly matches this sort of idea is the Robovan, which is, optimistically, several years off because it lacks a steering wheel and pedals and will require Full Self-Driving to be fully autonomous.

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Even if Tesla launches FSD next year, it will take a year or two to figure out manufacturing, go through regulatory hurdles with the EPA, and eventually enter mass production for customers.

The Model Y L has a variety of big changes that would be advantageous for the U.S. market, including a longer wheelbase, more comfortable seats, a third row that appears to be more spacious than Tesla’s six-seat Model Y that it previously offered, B-Pillar vents for rear passengers, and more.

However, Musk said it won’t come to the U.S. until next year, and that it “might not ever, given the advent of self-driving in America.”

To be blunt, I’m not sure if I truly believe that Musk thinks the Model Y L won’t come to the U.S. Some believe he said this to not Osborne Effect Model Y sales here, which seems more likely than anything.

Tesla Model Y L gets disappointingly far production date in the United States

People have been buying the Model Y for two years more than any other car in the world. To act as if many families would not appreciate the extra space seems very strange; a big complaint with the Model Y is that it simply does not fit larger families.

If you have four kids, you’re forced into the Model X, which might be too expensive for some families, as it starts at $79,990.

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While Tesla’s focus is undoubtedly on autonomy, it is important to remember that some people still really enjoy the act of driving their cars. Tesla has worked very hard to create a fun and sporty driving experience, especially in the new Model Y. Many consumers, including myself, like to take advantage of that.

Autonomy might eventually take over human driving completely, but in the near term, it does not seem as if that is the case. Even if someone were interested in never driving again, this longer and more spacious Model Y L would be an ideal option for American families that need the room for at least six passengers.

Quite a few big names in the Tesla community share this sentiment:

More than likely, Musk does not want to announce a more attractive option than the current Model Y, as many consumers would likely wait a year or two for the L in an effort to have more space.

In all honesty, I see the Model Y L coming to the United States, as it truly fits the bill as an ideal car for the modern American family.

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