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Elon Musk and Jack Ma discuss AI’s risks, Mars, and how humans can secure the future
Tesla and SpaceX CEO Elon Musk and Alibaba founder and Chairman Jack Ma kicked off the 2019 World Artificial Intelligence Conference in Shanghai, China, with an informal debate about AI and its implications to humanity. Throughout their conversation, Musk and Ma touched on several topics, from jobs, the need for educational reform, moving to Mars, and how humans’ way of life can improve in the future.
Opposing Views
The two billionaires have vastly differing points of view concerning artificial intelligence. While Musk is cautious about AI considering the dangers it may pose to humanity, Ma is far more optimistic. “I don’t think AI is a threat,” Ma said, responding to the Tesla CEO’s introductory points. Explaining further, the Alibaba founder noted that people are “street smart,” and thus, humanity will be fine even when AI evolves. Musk, for his part, doubled down on his point, arguing that AI’s rate of improvement is notable, and there will come a time when computers will outpace humans’ natural ability to understand it.
Making humans multi-planetary
Musk noted that humans have an opportunity today because this is the first time in history that it’s “possible to extend life beyond Earth.” He added that the window for this could either be open for a long or short time. Thus, it is in humanity’s best interest to secure its multi-planetary opportunities as quickly as possible.
Ma, for his part, argued that he has no interest in multi-planetary initiatives. “I’m not a fan of going to Mars,” he noted. Instead, Ma stated that it’s more pertinent for humans to try and preserve Earth. The Alibaba chairman nevertheless stated that the world needs innovators like Elon Musk, in as much as it needs people who are willing to do what needs to be done to save the planet. “We need heroes like you (who want to go to Mars), but we need heroes like us (who will fix Earth),” Ma said.
Musk explained that preserving Earth is a notable part of Tesla’s mission, from transitioning the transportation sector towards sustainability to fostering energy independence through solar power and batteries. Responding to Ma’s statements about using resources to focus on solving Earth’s problems, Musk noted that it will only take a fraction of the world’s GDP to make humans multi-planetary, comparable or even less than what people spend on something like makeup annually. “Spending resources on making life multi-planetary would be enough with just 1% of the earth’s GDP,” Musk noted.
AI’s threat to jobs
“Why do we need that many jobs anyway?” Ma said, explaining that humans have been fearing that tech will take jobs away for over a hundred years, and yet, jobs have increased. Ma believes that with AI’s help, humans can eventually reach a point where the average workweek is only 3 days per week, and the average workday is only 4 hours a day. This, according to Ma, opens the opportunity for humans to enjoy life more, and live even longer. “We need to be ready to enter the era where everyone will get to live 120 years,” he said.
Musk, for his part, stated that the advent of AI will likely make most jobs pointless. Considering AI’s evolution, Musk noted that the time will come when computers could eventually make their own software. With this in mind, it would be best for people to embrace areas such as engineering and fields of study that deal with human relations, as these will still be pertinent even in the artificial intelligence age. The Tesla CEO added that this is the reason behind Neuralink and its brain-machine interface, as it will prevent humans from being left behind.
The need for education reform
The Alibaba founder admitted that he is worried about the current educational system, which is still largely designed for the industrial period. Ma argues that today, there is a need to foster more creative and constructive education, which would allow humans to live a happier life. “I want to spend more time training kids on painting, singing, dancing, these creative things that make people live like humans,” he said. Ma added that people have heart, and that is where wisdom comes from. With this in mind, it is best for education to focus on training this aspect of the human being.
The Tesla CEO agreed that creative education is needed, particularly as today’s school system is “low bandwidth and extremely slow.” Musk noted that solutions such as Neuralink’s neural lace could be a difference-maker in this sense, as it would allow people to upload skills and learn them quickly, in a manner that is not too far from the concepts depicted in the sci-fi franchise The Matrix.
The dangers of AI
While the two disruptors agreed that there is a need for educational reform, Musk and Ma disagreed most about the potential risks of AI. Ma argued that compared to humans, computers are just a toy, adding that the best resource in the world is the human brain. “It’s impossible that humans could be controlled by machines. They’re machines that are invented by humans,” Ma said.
Musk noted that he very much disagrees with Ma’s stance. Arguing his point, the Tesla CEO stated that humans are capable of creating things that are superior to people. Humans are not the last step in evolution, Musk said, and people must be wary of thinking that they are smarter than they really are. “The most important mistake smart people make is that they think they’re smart. Computers are already smarter than people. We just keep moving the goalposts,” he stated.
Responding to Musk’s argument, Ma noted that the metrics humans use to benchmark themselves against AI (such as world champions in Chess playing against artificial intelligence) do not make sense, as games like Go are designed for human minds. “Why should humans play against computers? It’s stupid to compete with computers,” Ma quipped, adding that while computers can be clever, humans are smarter and wiser.
The future of humanity
Musk believes that one of the world’s greatest threats lie in its declining birthrate. “The world’s biggest issue in 20 years is population collapse,” he said, adding that this could be a big issue considering that humans generally have a “20-year boot sequence.” Ma agreed, stating that even China’s population, which currently stands at 1.4 billion people, sounds a lot today, but if one factors in the country’s declining birthrate, the country will see a completely different landscape in 20 years.
Musk added that more humans are definitely needed, especially with the start of multi-planetary initiatives. “Mars needs people,” he lightly said.
Ma ultimately believes that pursuing AI is wise to make people’s lives better. The Alibaba founded added that artificial intelligence can always do a better job when logic is involved, but when logic is not involved, humans will always be better. To thrive in the future, Ma stated that humans need not just IQ, but emotional intelligence, and (love) intelligence as well. Musk nodded, stating “I agree with him. Love is the answer.”
Watch Elon Musk and Jack Ma’s informal AI debate in the video below.
Elon Musk has acknowledged that early discussions with Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company (TSMC) could bring the company into his ambitious Terafab semiconductor project, signaling a possible partnership with the world’s leading contract chipmaker.
Musk confirmed that early talks are underway, but as of right now, they are “just discussions.” There is no confirmation of a deal nor dismissal of the possibility of one, leaving open the prospect of one of the largest advanced-chip collaborations under discussion in the U.S.
@wholemars Just discussions, but something may come of it
— Elon Musk (@elonmusk) October 3, 2026
The report that speculated on potential discussions between Terafab and TSMC comes from Tim Culpan, who outlined a few ways the collaboration could operate. One is TSMC using the project as an “anchor customer” for future facilities in Texas, potentially contributing process expertise, operational know-how, or capacity while Terafab provides capital, long-term purchase commitments, or both.
Tesla and SpaceX jointly developed the Terafab project, with Intel already participating on the tech side. Elon Musk announced the project in March, and it intends to produce more than one terawatt of AI compute capacity annually once fully built.
Company statements place the first phase at approximately $16.8 billion in cost, with later filings pointing to a total that could reach well into the tens of billions across multiple stages.
Intel joined the effort in April 2026 and is expected to supply its 14A manufacturing process for the full-scale plant.
Musk has said existing suppliers, including Samsung and TSMC, remain important for near-term needs; Tesla already has production arrangements with Samsung for AI5 and AI6 chips, but that future demand from Optimus robots, Cybercab vehicles, and planned space-based data centers will eventually exceed what the global industry can currently deliver.
Terafab is positioned as the long-term answer to that projected shortfall, and Tesla did something similar during COVID to avoid a chip shortage. This is just a much larger-scale solution.
If the partnership were to materialize, it would add TSMC’s industry-leading strategies to a project that already combines Tesla’s and SpaceX’s capital and offtake with Intel’s process technology. For now, the only public confirmation is Musk’s brief acknowledgement that conversations are occurring.
Tesla’s early strategy for charging units operating within its Robotaxi fleet reveals that the company surely has not lost any of that scrappy DNA that took it from an unlikely success story to the most valuable carmaker in the world.
An observer at a Tesla Supercharger in Austin spotted ten total Robotaxi vehicles arrive: one Cybercab and nine Model Y units. A Tesla employee was waiting at the lot and allowed each unit to park itself; every car that arrived had nobody in it.
Tesla wins FCC approval for wireless Cybercab charging system
The Tesla employee would walk around and plug each car in, adjusting the parking if needed:
So look at what I found. This is how Tesla charges unsupervised robotaxis at a public supercharger. Here is a driverless Cybercab showing up with no one in it. There are 9 other Model Ys that showed up too. A Tesla employee is walking around and plugging each of them in. She also moves the cars if they are not positioned well enough to charge. I love this process. One person charges multiple robotaxis at once
— Abhimanyu Yadav (@WorldlyReviewer) October 3, 2026
It’s a very interesting strategy, but extremely understandable at this early point in the Robotaxi program. It’s only been out for about 15 months, and Cybercab just entered the fleet in early September.
On top of that, Tesla is still working tirelessly on its wireless charging apparatus, and a new patent was just published regarding that product last week.
However, this is just another example of how Tesla still has plenty of that scrappy DNA leftover from the “production hell” days, when CEO Elon Musk slept on the floor of the factory, employees were working crazy hours, Tesla was building Sprung Structures to build cars in, and the company was tiptoeing on the brink of bankruptcy.
@Teslarati Sheer magnitude of the entire production system is hard to appreciate. Almost every element of production is >75% automated. Only wire harnesses & general assembly, which are <10% of production costs, are primarily manual.
— Elon Musk (@elonmusk) October 12, 2020
For now, Tesla is utilizing a simple system for recharging its ride-hailing vehicles, and that is a Tesla employee doing it manually until another solution presents itself. Sure, it’s not the most high-tech thing, and it certainly is not what people might have expected at this point in time, but it works, and it’s keeping the entire suite running.
Tesla is expanding its Robotaxi service hours by pushing the time back by one hour, keeping the ride-hailing service operational until 11 p.m., one hour later than previously.
CEO Elon Musk confirmed the change and offered a specific reason the expansion has been gradual: the system still needs to reliably avoid small pets that are difficult to see after dark, as they commonly blend into the color of the road, especially when they’re grey.
The latest adjustment restores only a fraction of the operating window the service once held. When paid Robotaxi rides began in Austin on June 22, 2025, vehicles ran from 6 a.m. to midnight.
In September 2025, Tesla lengthened the day to a 2 a.m. close, producing a 20-hour window that stayed in place for most of the following year. By early August of this year, the cutoff had already been pulled back; an August 26 update formalized hours of 6 a.m. to 10 p.m. across Austin and several other markets.
The October move to 11 p.m. therefore leaves the Austin day one hour shorter than the original launch schedule and three hours shorter than the 2025 peak.
Musk addressed the constraint directly after the announcement. “The main thing we’re trying to solve is making sure that we don’t run over pets when they’re hard to see at night,” he wrote. “Literally trying to avoid grey kittens on grey tarmac in the dark.”
Robotaxi operating hours moved from 10pm to 11pm.
The main thing we’re trying to solve is making sure that we don’t run over pets when they’re hard to see at night. Literally trying to avoid grey kittens on grey tarmac in the dark.
— Elon Musk (@elonmusk) October 3, 2026
The example points to a low-contrast perception problem in which a small animal can blend into the road surface under limited lighting.
Tesla’s vehicles rely on cameras and neural-network processing rather than lidar; Musk has previously argued that advanced vision software can extract useful information even in low light by analyzing photon counts, but the pet-detection case remains the stated limiter in later hours.
The modest schedule change arrives alongside faster growth in the purpose-built Cybercab fleet. Texas registration data tracked by observers showed the Austin Cybercab count rising sharply in recent weeks, reaching 169 vehicles after more than 100 were added in a short span.
Tesla has indicated that a broader shift toward 24-hour operation is tied to the upcoming FSD v15 software release expected this month on Robotaxi vehicles. Until that capability is validated for the edge cases Musk described, the company continues to add service time incrementally rather than jumping straight to overnight coverage.
The one-hour extension gives Austin riders a later option for evening trips while the underlying detection work continues.
Elon Musk teases TSMC as potential Terafab partner
Tesla reveals early Robotaxi charging strategy, showing scrappy DNA
